About Ketostix/Lipostix

[kate58]

Questions about these come up all the time, and some people seem to rely on them a lot, so I thought I would post this to have information in one place.

Although Dr Atkins seems to suggest in his book that these tests are very accurate and can measure the degree of ketosis you are in, and hence the rate at which you are burning fat, the collective experience of people here suggests that it isn't quite as simple as that.

The following points may be helpful:

1. A color change means you are excreting ketones, burning fat and are in ketosis....
... but is is wise to remember that it is possible to be in ketosis and to not lose or even to gain weight. While a positive test means you are burning fat as your primary fuel it doesn't necessarily mean you are losing weight. If you eat excessively some fuel will be used by your body, some will be excreted (making the sticks positive) and some will be retained (and stored as fat).

2. The degree of colour change is not important
With respect to identifying ketosois - you are either in ketosis or you are not, the sticks do not accurately measure degree in all people. Different people get different colours and this is completely unrelated to either their degree or rate of weight loss or their adherance to the plan.

3. No colour change does not necessarily mean you are not in ketosis
Some people never see a change. No change just means that the sticks are detecting none of the specific ketones for which it checks in your urine.

This may be a fault in the sticks or just the way it is for you. You may well be excreting different ketones for which the sticks do not check or just using up all your ketones in response to your energy needs or it may be that you will never see a change due to individual variation in reponse to this particular test.

If you get a negative test: Look over your food and water intake, be sure you are eating right and drinking and eating enough. Look for other signs of Ketosis - a smell on your breath, a metallic taste in your mouth, signs that you are losing weight/inchs. Don't fret about the sticks.

4. A dark colour may indicate that you are dehydrated
If your water intake is low and/or your salt intake is high, you can easily become dehydrated and therefore produce more concentrated urine with a higher concentration of ketones. Or a dark colour may be normal for you - if you are drinking lots of water, peeing regularly and showing no other indicators of dehydration, it may just be a personal thing.

If you get a dark colour: Check your water and salt intake to ensure you are getting enough liquids and are not dehydrated. A common sign of dehydration is dark coloured urine - if you are drinking plenty your urine should be very pale yellow to colourless, and you should need to use the bathroom regularly. If you are happy that you are fully hydrated, don't worry about the actual colour change on the sticks.

Given all of this potential for variation, the sticks should be considered as no more than a rough guide which some people find useful. It isn't necessary to use them and it is certainly not wise to base all your decisions around them.

[*Emma*]

Great post Kate

You may want to add in that tests should not be done in a morning, after exercise, after alcohol & i think there may be one more which has completely left me head...

[texasparalegal]

AWESOME! I posted a question earlier regarding ketosis, but you answered it. I was wondering if it were possible to be in ketosis (dark purple) and still not lose weight. Thanks for the great post!!!

[daquix]

Originally Posted by kate58

Questions about these come up all the time, and some people seem to rely on them a lot, so I thought I would post this to have information in one place.

Although Dr Atkins seems to suggest in his book that these tests are very accurate and can measure the degree of ketosis you are in, and hence the rate at which you are burning fat, the collective experience of people here suggests that it isn't quite as simple as that.

The following points may be helpful:

1. A color change means you are excreting ketones, burning fat and are in ketosis....
... but is is wise to remember that it is possible to be in ketosis and to not lose or even to gain weight. While a positive test means you are burning fat as your primary fuel it doesn't necessarily mean you are losing weight. If you eat excessively some fuel will be used by your body, some will be excreted (making the sticks positive) and some will be retained (and stored as fat).

2. The degree of colour change is not important
With respect to identifying ketosois - you are either in ketosis or you are not, the sticks do not accurately measure degree in all people. Different people get different colours and this is completely unrelated to either their degree or rate of weight loss or their adherance to the plan.

3. No colour change does not necessarily mean you are not in ketosis
Some people never see a change. No change just means that the sticks are detecting none of the specific ketones for which it checks in your urine.

This may be a fault in the sticks or just the way it is for you. You may well be excreting different ketones for which the sticks do not check or just using up all your ketones in response to your energy needs or it may be that you will never see a change due to individual variation in reponse to this particular test.

If you get a negative test: Look over your food and water intake, be sure you are eating right and drinking and eating enough. Look for other signs of Ketosis - a smell on your breath, a metallic taste in your mouth, signs that you are losing weight/inchs. Don't fret about the sticks.

4. A dark colour may indicate that you are dehydrated
If your water intake is low and/or your salt intake is high, you can easily become dehydrated and therefore produce more concentrated urine with a higher concentration of ketones. Or a dark colour may be normal for you - if you are drinking lots of water, peeing regularly and showing no other indicators of dehydration, it may just be a personal thing.

If you get a dark colour: Check your water and salt intake to ensure you are getting enough liquids and are not dehydrated. A common sign of dehydration is dark coloured urine - if you are drinking plenty your urine should be very pale yellow to colourless, and you should need to use the bathroom regularly. If you are happy that you are fully hydrated, don't worry about the actual colour change on the sticks.

Given all of this potential for variation, the sticks should be considered as no more than a rough guide which some people find useful. It isn't necessary to use them and it is certainly not wise to base all your decisions around them.

I'm still confused about #2, as Dr. Atkins says in DANDR, that the darker the sticks, the more ketones you are burning, and therefore the more fat you are burning.

[ThinSoon]

Great post!



Tracey

[kate58]

I'm still confused about #2, as Dr. Atkins says in DANDR, that the darker the sticks, the more ketones you are burning, and therefore the more fat you are burning.

I know, and I think it is confusing too. But the collective experience of this board tells another story. I did look into this a while back out of interest.

We basically produce three different ketones: beta-hydroxybutyrate, acetone, and acetoacetate. The sticks test for acetoacetate and/or acetone (depending on which ones you use), but none of them react at all with beta-hydroxybutyrate.

This results in two issues which I think are at the heart of this:

1. The first is that beta-hydroxybutyrate is most likely to be highest in someone on a high fat diet. So you could be pumping that out, but producing very little of the other two, and you'd be losing fat but showing little or nothing on the sticks.

2. The second is really interesting: Ketostix - probably the most commonly used one - only detects acetoacetate and will give a false-negative result if acetone is present. So that totally explains why some people never turn the sticks - they are producing the 'wrong' (from the sticks point of view) ketone.

I don't know why one person would produce a different spectrum of ketones than another person, but it seems to happen.

Bear in mind that this test is designed not for people doing a low carb diet, it's designed to monitor diabetics for ketoacidosis. We've just 'borrowed' them for a slightly different purpose. So tests that are intended to detect a pathological change, are now being used to test for a physiological one. Accuracy is bound to suffer.

I think it would have been better - though a LOT more confusing - if Dr A had said something like:

"Given the same specific gravity of urine, the colour change reflects the degree of lipolysis in many people much of the time."

But even that would have been very simplistic.

[rozigrl221]

Thanks Kate.....this is so helpful.

[babywoogie]

thankyou for this post......i was about to ask about my ketosis, I'm in day 7 of induction, my sticks are turning out dark pink and yesterday while chatting to my hubby in the car, so you'll know the distance, he commented that my breath is not really a pleasent one.

is there anyhting i can do about that?

[daquix]

Originally Posted by kate58

I know, and I think it is confusing too. But the collective experience of this board tells another story. I did look into this a while back out of interest.

We basically produce three different ketones: beta-hydroxybutyrate, acetone, and acetoacetate. The sticks test for acetoacetate and/or acetone (depending on which ones you use), but none of them react at all with beta-hydroxybutyrate.

This results in two issues which I think are at the heart of this:

1. The first is that beta-hydroxybutyrate is most likely to be highest in someone on a high fat diet. So you could be pumping that out, but producing very little of the other two, and you'd be losing fat but showing little or nothing on the sticks.

2. The second is really interesting: Ketostix - probably the most commonly used one - only detects acetoacetate and will give a false-negative result if acetone is present. So that totally explains why some people never turn the sticks - they are producing the 'wrong' (from the sticks point of view) ketone.

I don't know why one person would produce a different spectrum of ketones than another person, but it seems to happen.

Bear in mind that this test is designed not for people doing a low carb diet, it's designed to monitor diabetics for ketoacidosis. We've just 'borrowed' them for a slightly different purpose. So tests that are intended to detect a pathological change, are now being used to test for a physiological one. Accuracy is bound to suffer.

I think it would have been better - though a LOT more confusing - if Dr A had said something like:

"Given the same specific gravity of urine, the colour change reflects the degree of lipolysis in many people much of the time."

But even that would have been very simplistic.

Gotchya. Well thanks for taking the time to explain that. It is very much appreciated!

[DigitalMocking]

Fantastic post. TBH I wish DANDR didn't reference ketostix at all, they seem to cause more confusion than anything else.